Implied odds in no limit
The concept of implied odds isn't really the same in no limit as it is in limit.
In limit your concern is about getting some extra bets on future betting rounds. But in no limit it's really about winning or losing a stack.
This came up in a thread on playing AKo in a no-limit game.
I had pointed out that AKo against a very tight early position raiser (QQ+, AKs, AKo) is an equity dog and has no implied odds since it won't get a of action against QQ.
A commenter expressed a dissent because he says you have implied odds from an expected contiuation bet even if an A flops.
That's not really implied odds to me. The only flop that has any chance at all of busting QQ is a TJQ flop and even then you aren't really a huge favorite with the flopped nuts. If you get action with a flop of AKx you're in pretty bad shape, probably drawing almost dead.
In limit your concern is about getting some extra bets on future betting rounds. But in no limit it's really about winning or losing a stack.
This came up in a thread on playing AKo in a no-limit game.
I had pointed out that AKo against a very tight early position raiser (QQ+, AKs, AKo) is an equity dog and has no implied odds since it won't get a of action against QQ.
A commenter expressed a dissent because he says you have implied odds from an expected contiuation bet even if an A flops.
That's not really implied odds to me. The only flop that has any chance at all of busting QQ is a TJQ flop and even then you aren't really a huge favorite with the flopped nuts. If you get action with a flop of AKx you're in pretty bad shape, probably drawing almost dead.
Labels: Implied odds
posted by Gary Carson at 6:26 PM
3 Comments:
Stacking your opponent is an aim of cash play, not tournaments where the example hand was from. Against a tight early position raiser you have to think "this guy is going to fear any coordinated flop. What are the chances of one? How can we best make him fold?"
I wouldn't call all-in preflop with AK versus that tight EP, because as you rightly say, AK isn't great against his range. But it's sufficiently good at showdown that when you combine it with our position and our fold equity, we have to play.
Personally I'm calling with any two cards here. The narrower his range, the better we are postflop. ;)
I am looking forward to playing nerkul. There is nothing better for a tight raiser than to be called by an overconfident LAG who will put in a ridiculous, easy-to-read bluff just because the board is coordinated. Because, dude, while you're thinking "How can we best make tighty fold?", I'm thinking "How likely is it that the tard has precisely the hand that he would need on this flop?"
Tight players are very often miss-read by kids with FPS.
I long, long time ago I used to play in a 10c ante, $2 to go NL draw game. It's correct to play very, very tight when opening with that structure.
One night I went well over 2 hours without playing a hand. Some new guy was sitting on my right and commented on it. When my hand flashed once when mucking 2 pair from early position his eyes nearly bugged out.
Finially I got a hand I wanted to play. He limped in. I raised a little, making it $5 I think. He goes all in for about $100 since he knows I'm a tight ass who can't call.
What the hell did that idiot think I was raising with? Did he think I was going to draw cards?
Very tight early position openers have a hand, they don't need to hit the flop to still have a hand.
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